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  • #6
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    If you ever wondered how the Texas courts view a woman, this makes it clear. Her brain and soul are not important -- she is an incubator and can be used as such if she is not able to speak or resist.
  • #30
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    The state won't value this baby at all after it is born. Will they provide care? Who will pay for 24 hr a day care if it's born disabled and has no mother?
  • #68
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    That's such BS. You've got it shrewd completely backwards. No one in Texas thinks women are nothing but incubators...that's ridiculous. They're not saying anything bad about women..they're showing concern for possibly saving the baby. But, in this situation, with the high likeliness that the baby is not even viable, I think they should respect the woman's wishes.
  • #109
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    She spoke to her family. The father of the child has spoken the grandparents have spoken. THE STATE won. NOW we wait.
  • #11
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    There is a growing, developing, cells-multiplying (biological definition of life) human being inside her body. 2 lives in question here.

    Just because one human being hasn't exited a vagina yet, it's not entitled with the unalienable, again UNALIENABLE (look it up), Right to Life???

    Again, shame on you!
  • #14
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    Abortions are conducted well after 18 weeks and her wishes should be honored. Her husband and her mother want her wishes honored, so we have here another instance of governmental intrusion into private lives.
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  • #1
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    It's not just her life that would be ending if they take her off life support. Need to take into the account of the unborn child. Sure they don't know if it's alive or dead but we should just discard it none the less?
  • #47
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    It's a pretty simple question. If you want the state making decisions like this for you in spite of YOU stated desires - vote (R). If you think that the state has no right sticking it's nose into this family's business then vote (D).
  • #66
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    @Joshacham "it's not just her life that would be ending"

    That is YOUR opinion, not a fact. It also doesn't give you or anyone else the right to decide what medical decisions someone makes. NOT YOUR BUSINESS.
  • #67
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    @JoshPuchall it most certainly does give us the right...

    Since we tax payers are paying to keep her on life support.
  • #70
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    @JoshPuchall If the baby has a heartbeat, then yes, it is a fact that both lives would end. The mother IS the baby's "life support system."

    That being said, the gray area here is how long did the baby go without oxygen? If the mother had brain swelling and damage from lack of oxygen, then most likely the baby has it as well.

    This isn't an easy decision, no matter which side of the fence you are on.
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  • #20
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    The right is always telling us there is too much government involved in our personal lives.....until they want the government involved
  • #56
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    This one is a tough one for me! You are right, but I do feel like there is a life inside her! So I am struggling with this one...

    My question is....are you liberals truly this cavalier about life? It makes no difference to you the baby is in there...alive?
  • #77
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    @1971tennessee Whether or not the baby is alive is not my concern to care about, nor is it yours, nor anyone's but that husband's. Abortion is legal, and if this family chooses to have an abortion that is nobody's matter but theirs.

    Conservatives are no less cavalier about life, and we both know it. If conservatives cared as much for children AFTER they were born, America would be a far nicer place
  • #82
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    @1971tennessee Why do all conservatives think repeating a person's post back to them is a valid response to everything? Is that all you are capable of coming up with?
  • #83
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    @Poltal liberals want to take other people's money and continue the dependency of children and parents on the all knowing government!

    I would MUCH rather see those parents get a job! Provide for their own families ! And teach those children to rely on themselves and hard work! In stead of leading the liberal dream and relying on the government for everything!
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  • #9
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    No matter what you believe in, Time, or Fate, or God clearly did not have in their plans the birth of this baby, let nature take its course.
  • #218
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    Take her off life support, as the husband/father wishes. Then let nature take its course.
  • #21
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    She does not have a will or an advanced directive. However, her husband has said that because she is a paramedic, they both discussed at length what their wishes are, and she was adamant about not wanting to be on life support.
  • #60
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    You do realize the extra ordinary efforts they will have to put on the brain dead woman to keep the baby alive right? The millions of dollars they will bill the husband, the regulating of her heartbeat, internal organs, tubes to keep her insides healthy and get nutrients to the baby? The possible brain damage it will suffer because of the host being kept alive by extreme medical measures not to mention he has no idea when she collapsed? It could not live outside the host on its own. Imagine the heartache this man and her family have to go through seeing her body as nothing more than an incubator. And there is not. 100% chance this baby will make it and all the inteferring and emotional and physical stress put on them could be for nothing. Its a horrific situation and here you are more worried about an undeveloped human than the lives of those that will be impacted the most. This baby doesnt know its alive and would not feel pain if they took the mother off life support. However the husband and this woman's family are people who have to suffer the consequences and possible heartbreak of losing the baby. And the woman all over again when they take her off support permanently.
  • #65
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    @Threeper301 Both lifes have already been lost. The fetal brain requires a CONSTANT supply of oxygen. What is currently in her womb will never be a baby, it is a vegitable.
  • #69
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    @Threeper301 The physical well being of this baby is up in the air. The longer its in the host body that has no control over natural regulation, the higher its chances of having a very difficult life. And that is very easy for you to say its ok to happen because its not happening to you. Texas is toying with these peoples lives. Its not right.
  • #73
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    @bleakoutlook While at the same time toying with the life of an unborn child, but that doesn't matter to you, does it? You keep calling the mother a "host" as if a baby or child is nothing but a parasite or a disease.

    Your choice of words disgusts me.
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  • #32
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    A significant other, who 'finds' a victim of such a crime OFTEN guilty of committing the crime.'Doctors suspected 'pulmonary embolism but didn't know with complete certainty". Maybe it's because the husband is an EMT and more knowledgeable than the average husband as to causes of death, etc. Maybe it's because I'm a suspicious man and have seen the evil that people do. I would want to know with COMPLETE CERTAINTY that the husband been completely cleared of any suspicion before proceeding one way or the other. Why on earth would a husband, who allegedly loved his wife, and wanted to have a child with her, not want to do everything possible to FIRST find out after whatever tests could be conducted, if the child was going to be born normal or not before pulling the plug on his poor wife and his yet-to-be-born child? I understand if the child was going to be born as a complete vegetable, but why not wait and find out first? There are those of us who manage to live on our own and function fairly well even with mild brain injury. I'm kind of suspicious here.
  • #49
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    Isn't an autopsy required to fully determine the incident? She isn't dead yet, that might be why they haven't figured it out yet.
  • #118
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    Because the WOMAN did not want to be on life support, and it's not just the husband who says so. Pregnancy doesn't make the woman irrelevant.
  • #167
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    Without an autopsy there can be no definitive conclusion as to the cause of death. Can't do an autopsy if the body is being treated as an incubator.
  • #27
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    I'd like a little more information before jumping in on this conversation. Has an Amniocentesis been done? Ultrasound? I'd like to know if the child is progressing in development. I'm having a moral conundrum on this one.
  • #38
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    I worded this a bit awkwardly. And it is DIFFICULT to word because one doesn't know with COMPLETE CERTAINTY even what caused the wife's current condition. A crime MAY have been committed. Not enough is revealed in the article to be able to know with COMPLETE CERTAINTY whether it was or not. If a crime HAD been committed, then " A significant other, who 'finds' a victim of a crime IS often guilty of committing the crime". I hope that's better. It's as well as I can come to expressing my thought in writing on this subject.
  • #45
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    If memory serves me you work in the medical field. What kind of testing can be done to see if the child is progressing normally?
  • #59
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    @truthsayer There are a variety of tests that can be done - ultrasounds can provide an image of the fetus and identify obvious physical deformities. Amniocentesis can analyze the fluid bath surrounding the fetus and give clues about its physical functions.

    The more important issue in this case, though, is brain function. An intrauterine EEG could assess the brain function, but there are technical considerations I am not knowledgeable enough to discuss. I expect at some point the physicians will raise the topic with the family.

    While a fetus is generally protected from a lot of bad things that happen to the mom, she was pulse-less for an extended amount of time (brain damage starts at around 3 minutes) and it's hard to say if the fetal brain was as damaged as hers. You always want to hope for the best, but the scenario here isn't one to inspire confidence.
  • #39
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    The husband should be able to do what his wife wanted. It isn't right for her to lay there and be an incubator of a pregnancy that might result in a stillborn or a severely disabled child that the husband will be stuck caring for. I think if they are going to insist that she stay on life support, they need to find out how the fetus is developing maybe by an ultrasound. I feel sorry for her family and hope everything works out for them.
  • #135
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    @Yank no I call government interference in the natural order of things a artificial god complex by the Texas government. Using a dead human as a incubator is a crime against nature.
  • #145
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    @mwr so you are saying we should stop with organ transplants, resuscitation, artificial insemination and other affronts to god?
  • #161
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    @Yank never mind you are not capable of having a conversation on topic you want to ignore the situation of this topic for your personal agenda. If you think keeping a dead person hooked up to machines for 5 months 1 month so far and4 to go) is ok you have strange values.
  • #162
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    @Yank if someone had specifically requested not to receive an organ transplant, resuscitation, or artificial insemination, and the state forced them to receive one....then yes, the state is playing god
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  • #18
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    The same results the mother is experiencing from lack of oxygen is most likely what the baby is experiencing also. If the baby is born normal it will be a miracle, if not the husband/father will have to make the same decision about taking the baby off life support. What do the ultrasounds show about the growth and movement of the unborn baby? If the baby is moving, then the baby may be alright. If the baby shows no movement then the baby too is comatose. The baby would be moving at this stage of the pregnancy.
  • #36
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    @falco_alba
    The ultrasound would show more than a heartbeat. Movement is key to knowing the condition of the baby. You can actually agitate the baby with the ultrasound device to get reflex reactions from the baby. I've done plenty of ultrasounds to know that. If the baby does not respond with movement to being agitated, that is not a good sign. There's really no further test that could be done to tell you the condition of the baby in this circumstance. Movement and growth on ultrasound are it.
  • #48
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    @BelinKS

    I understand how an ultrasound works. I was just relaying information I've read since this news came up a few days ago. I believe they are waiting until 20 weeks to see if the development is normal.
  • #61
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    @BelinKS

    Problem with that. It's Texas law now that abortions cannot be performed after 20 weeks. Would this qualify?
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  • #13
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    This is a heartbreaking story and my thoughts and prayers go out to this family. For sure I would never want to be in the husband's shoes. There is quite a bit of prayer and reflection that one must do to make a decision of this magnitude either way.

    What makes me angry is the flippant way liberals are apt to just discard a life. Government is a burden and in our way on many issues, but it does have a legitimate purpose. Part of that purpose is ensuring the rights of its citizens. What better way to start off protecting the rights of its citizens than by making sure its citizens can be born.

    I don't know the answer in this case. I never claimed I did. I know that the knee jerk reaction too many liberals have in wanting to throw a baby's life away is wrong. Let's sit back, take a few moments to truly reflect on this situation before we unanimously decide to execute a baby just because the mother got sick.

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    America, rightward!
  • #116
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    Fetuses aren't citizens; by definition, citizens are born or naturalized. This law violates the intent and purpose of RvW and needs to be challenged iN court. It also abrogates the rights of the husband as guardian.
  • #166
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    The mother 'got sick', the mother died. Her body is hooked up to machines to keep it operating, the mother is dead.
  • #94
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    I thought the people in Texas didn't want the government interfering in their lives, but here they are doing just that. If I was the husband, I wouldn't pay for any care from the time he wanted to pull the plug. If the child is born with severe issues or is stillborn, lawsuit.
  • #80
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    Not to sound callous, but who pays for all of this? Will the father be held responsible for the baby's potential enormous medical bills following birth and who is paying for the enormous cost of keeping the wife on life support?
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