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  • #15
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    From what I saw, the man's actions did not warrant arrest and being handcuffed. Being escorted out, fine, arrested not fine.
  • #210
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    @Slowmo Did I say "resisting arrest"? No, I said "resisting". Slowmo, please read the following two sections of LEGAL code:
    SEC. 11-2-10 FAILURE TO OBEY LAWFUL ORDER; RESISTING AN OFFICER.
    (a)
    Lawful Orders.
    It shall be unlawful for any person to fail to obey the direction or order of
    a police officer while such police officer is acting in an official capacity in carrying ou
    t his
    or her duties.
    (b)
    Resisting or Interfering with Officer Prohibited.
    It shall be unlawful for any person to
    resist or in any way interfere with any police officer or member of the Police Department
    or any person called to assist such officer, or to thre
    aten, resist or interfere with such
    officer or person or to advise or encourage any other person to resist or interfere with such
    officer or person in the discharge of his/her duty, or to in any way interfere with or hinder
    or prevent him/her from discharg
    ing his/her duty as such officer or assistant, or to offer or
    endeavor to do so, or to in any manner assist any person in the custody of any law
    enforcement officer to escape or to attempt to escape from such custody, or to try to
    persuade any person to es
    cape from the custody of such officer, or to rescue or attempt to
    rescue any person so in custody or to fail to obey the order or direction of such officer
    while such officer is acting in his/her official capacity in carrying out his/her duties.
    _________
    or in Florida,
    _________
    2. Resisting an Officer Without Violence - If the arrestee resists, obstructs or OPPOSES an officer while the officer is executing a legal duty, they face a first-degree misdemeanor. This often involves someone running from the police, or someone not following an officer's directions.
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  • #6
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    If the school board was doing their job correctly, that book NEVER would have been put into the hands of a child anyways. They were going to arrest him before he even spoke.
  • #76
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    I am so unnerved by this. I see the same types of things happening here in Colorado. Their ABILITY to use force as well as their inclination to use it often is downright frightening. Every parent or parent to be (yes, you @IronicGuy ;) ) should be looking at this with a detailed microscope.
  • #117
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    Of they had my 14 year old daughter reading about "sweet sticky cum" I would have been arrested for hurting someone
  • #125
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    @Sharptonsux It's one page of the book not the whole book, and do you really think teens don't know about sex and many of them haven't already had it? This book also has alot of good things to teach about bullying and maybe it would stop more school shootings. Censorship is never right.
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  • #28
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    There's been a war against violent video games for a while now, so why force the students to read a book about a school shooting? And rape? Also heard the dad on radio saying he asked the school principal to read the offensive parts of the book, the principal said he didn't feel comfortable reading it...so let's make the 14 year old students read it?
  • #70
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    But the content isn't the issue. The issue is decorum in a public place. The parent didn't like the book, he used his time to say so, and then kept going. If the rest of the parents and the board don't see a problem, then accept that you're in the minority and take it.

    That's how Democracy works.
  • #98
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    @Hold_Please We do not live in a Democracy or a democracy. We live in a representative republic (not Republic). Are you saying all minorities should just accept what the majority tells them to do?
  • #106
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    @Hold_Please Clearly, he did NOT " use his time to say so". You only get to talk when the chair or moderator recognizes you. Read Roberts Rules of Order, dating back more than a century; a direct quote is: "Must be recognized by the Chair before speaking! "
  • #112
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    @Hold_Please so that's it u have 2 mins to say something then shut the hell up and sit down or we have u removed and that's what u call democracy at work wow i guess i was taught wrong all these yrs i didn't realize democracy was make a statement then shut up i thought u debate the subject back and forth the come up with a salution then its voted on but i was taught wrong it u say a statement then shut up and the board ,cops. or who ever is in charge does what thy want then that's democracy ok i got it now
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  • #14
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    Even if he had broken a rule it's not law and his behavior is nowhere near the realm of disorderly so I'd like to know what in the hell he was actually charged with. I'd sue the police department and the officer himself. Then go back to the next meeting... break their rule again and if need be, another lawsuit... and again, and again, until they finally got the point.
  • #82
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    He's charged with resisting without violence and/or disobeying a lawful order, is my guess... he disrupted the meeting (did NOT just properly address the board as the procedures instruct), and the officer politely asked him to stop, and he was obstinate about it. I tend to think that an arrest is probably a bit excessive,
  • #114
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    I suppose YOUR idea of "disorderly" involves punching someone in the mouth! Dictionary says: "causing a problem especially in a public place by making a lot of noise, behaving violently, etc." and "synonym: unruly". A different dictionary says: "disorderly behavior - any act of molesting, INTERRUPTING, hindering, AGITATING, or arousing from a state of repose or otherwise depriving inhabitants of the peace and quiet to which they are entitled."
  • #148
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    @Nikflorida

    That's not a crime. A cop telling you to be quiet is not a lawful order no matter how much they assert that it is.
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  • #16
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    Ever read Huck Finn, or how about Catcher in the Rye? Someone somewhere would find these classics offensive in one way out another, yet they teach us so much. So a one page sex scene made a dad lose his cool....now he wants the book banned. Well its called the real world. People have sex. If he wants his daughter to have a sheltered education, then he should have enrolled her in a private school. That would have been his choice. Why should this man choose the content of what is taught by educators. What gives this man the right to censor a book in a public school.
  • #90
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    @DontBlameMe2 No it's not. Good parenting is reading something with your children and working with them to understand it. It's not sheltering them from something YOU don't feel comfortable with.

    What's amazing to me is none of you who support this disruptive father has mentioned having a problem with the school shooting, just the sex. Get your priorities straight.
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  • #29
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    She is right about not trusting public officials. It is everyone's duty as upstanding citizens not to trust them. But they are not the only ones to be distrusted. Her dad is a lawyer. She should know better, then maybe he has taught her well how to manipulate.
  • #126
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    Didn't make anything clearer or give info on the Dad in the meeting. Iwas hoping for a clip of the whole meeting. It could show in the Dad's favor or just show he was out of line.
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  • #20
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    You can speak as freely as you like. He had his two minutes-time to choose another venue.

    No right is absolute or without limitations.-D.C. v Heller

    Don't confuse freedom with anarchy.
    -Paulden Zangpo
  • #46
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    @PauldenZangpo That would be abridgement and prohibition.....look at the First Amendment.....

    Don't confuse arrogance with sense......
  • #51
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    @Knightkore huh? He was given his opportunity to petition for a redress of grievances. He exceeded his allotted time, thereby infringing upon the ability of other tax paying citizens to petition for a redress of grievances. There was no violation of his 1st Amendment right. It's common sense, yo!
  • #50
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    The guy was a bit of a dick...but...it seemed like a fairly civil debate to me...arresting him was uncalled for ...if they are going to arrest people just for being a dick...they are going to have to built a lot more prisons....oh, wait....that's right they are already doing that
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  • #104
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    Police state in action. A father can't complain about the school's pushing immoral crap on his kid. If this guy recommended sex and abortion on his kid if who be celebrated as an enlightened citizen.
  • #455
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    what 'immoral crap'... and you're right. the father can't complain about anything at a school board meeting. there's a proper time and place for that.
  • #479
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    @dances-weebles Does not the father have a right to determine what he feels is best for his child,
    or have we allowed the state to control everything? If the father feels that it's immoral crap then it is. Would you object if your kid was taught about creationism?
  • #494
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    @magnacarta the father has that right as long as what he 'determines' is true. in this case it's simply a bogus opinion. opinions don't count in raising children... especially by the time they're 14 years old. by then most kids can decide for themselves what's best for them.

    and yes, i most certainly would object to creationism being taught in a school as if it were scientific fact rather than ancient israelite mythology.
  • #495
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    @magnacarta oh... and creationism is a religious view held by only some superstitious people and shouldn't be taught in any school, public or private. they can teach their religious stuff in church.
  • #512
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    @dances-weebles I read the book, did not see anything particularly immoral in it for a modern novel. Picoult's books are always intelligent and insightful. What bothered me was , of course, the idea of school shootings and the idea of people acting like their fellow students' lives were of no importance. Which was the story was about . Funny he did not have an objection to the violence in the story?
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  • #395
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    "Meanie
    More idiot behavior from another school who believe they are above the law. "

    Sadly they are .
  • #475
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    @dances-weebles

    WRONG! Were there signs stating "you will be arrested if you speak"? He wasn't belligerent, uncontrollable, raging, etc. he merely spoke his mind for 33 seconds. Perhaps being disruptive yes, but not to the point of being arrested. Have him removed if necessary, but arrested? Give me a break.

    Once again heed your own advice, you seem to forget to think what you're saying before saying it.
  • #493
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    @Meanie if he had only spoken for 33 seconds, then he wouldn't have been silenced... and nobody has the right to disrupt a formal meeting of any sort. the whole point is that the school board meeting isn't the proper time or place to even bring the subject up... there are proper ways to do such things... and it always starts with a written letter. another FACT is that nobody has the right speak unless the chair person of a meeting gives permission.
  • #517
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    @dances-weebles

    Go back and view the video. He started speaking as the other guy was finishing. When he starts, the video was at 20 seconds as he finished, it was 53...do the math.

    If my tax dollars are being spent on a public school where my kids attend, I would plan to speak up as well. They are not above the law. They are a school district and board supported by US. As I stated, formal meeting or not, remove him...ok, arrest him...idiocy.

    As always, your liberal easy going let the man shove it in my ass attitude is why this nation is raising a bunch of sissies. My tax dollars ensure my liberty to speak up without causing harm to another and that's what this guy did. Big EFFING deal....he used 33 seconds. F*cking ludicrous.
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  • #13
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    Give it a rest, dad. A book with a sex scene in it isn't going to drive your little girl to run out and lose her virginity. That will happen no matter what she reads and whether you like it or not. Maybe have already happened. Hide your daughter from reality and she won't know how to handle herself when she needs to.

    The school educates more children than just yours, Mr. Baer. It has to decide the appropriateness of materials for the age level of hundreds of children. It can't focus on your little darling because you feel she is too immature to handle that material.

    If the school isn't doing the job YOU want, keep her home and teach her yourself. I also hope you don't own a TV or the internet and that you are by her side every instant of her life because it sounds like you are afraid to trust her.
  • #77
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    I'm guessing that the school isn't "teaching" morality at all... fact is, you don't "teach" morality, you "indoctrinate" it, and schools very specifically are not in the business of indoctrinating people. That's the business of families and churches.
  • #379
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    Which sex scene are you talking about? The one I saw is a rape scene. Rape is not sex. Rape is violence. I don't think 14 year olds are ready to handle this.
  • #648
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    @scs

    Are we talking about a rape scene in a porn movie or a rape scene where it is treated as the horrific act that it is? I haven't read the book, but I'm going to make a wild assumption here that it's probably not a graphic and intensely detailed account of a rape. Do you think 14 year olds are stupid? Do you think they don't know what goes on in the world? Have you ever been 14? Were you THAT sheltered that a rape scene in a high school book of fiction would have caused you years of therapy?

    If this dad doesn't want his daughter reading this particular book, discuss it with the teacher. I'm sure they could work out something. Don't go to a school board meeting and make an ass of yourself and try to change the class curriculum for everyone.
  • #11
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    If my daughter's school district put that in her hands prior to the age of 18 without my express consent, I'd be raising hell too! What the hell? When I was in school,(I'm 33) Shakespeare was considered racy..
  • #85
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    @Hold_Please Yes, but have you read the passage in question? It's way beyond racy. It amounts to a verbal depiction of pornography. I'm not okay with it. We keep pushing the envelope further and further, when will it be enough?
  • #223
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    The proper way to raise hell is in the courts or the legislature or complaining to the school board.
    Shakespeare is racy for those that bother to learn the meanings of the words used when the plays were written.
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  • #2
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    The speaking out of term was one thing, I don't fault his passion for defending what he feels is right for his daughter. But initially the cop asked him to leave and he showed signs of non-compliance. If he simply got up and walked out, I doubt he would've been taken into custody like that.
  • #37
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    >>>right for his daughter<<<
    But he wants the page of book shown to the whole world.

    The cop overreacted as he was probably intimidated by the Baer dare to cop to arrest him. He challenged the cops authority and cop did not handle it the best way.
  • #44
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    I stand with the dad.....the arrogant stupidity of the school officials and their holier than thou attitude needs to be taken down a couple pegs or two.....
  • #105
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    If he is truly a lawyer, he is going to have a field day with these morons, including the police. They are going to have to prove he exceed the two minute rule and it's going to have to be documented. Concerned parents have the right to express their concerns without the fear of being arrested, the school board put a rule in place to prevent parents from challenging them or questioning them. Once again an example of people in power abusing that power to cover their ass instead of doing what they were hired to do.
  • #142
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    Exactly where does the constitution grant special rights to parents? A lot of the problems in schools come from the involvement of stupid/arrogant parents meddling in a subject they have no training (education).
  • #204
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    I hope he does pursue this. There was no reason for an arrest, that's going too far. Escorting him from the meeting was enough and the cop should have refused to do more.
  • #222
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    @cpeter133 what exactly is your point? You said absolutely nothing that has to do with anything I said. You ramble off crap about the constitution and I can bet you couldn't recite one paragraph of it without looking it up, I'll take it even a step further and bet no where in your home do you have a full copy of the constitution. Stupid parents? Good one!
  • #260
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    @cpeter133 Where does the constitution grant citizens the right to vote when most are too stupid(here's a hint look in the mirror)? Remember he is not just a parent he is a taxpayer. That school board should be worried that the taxpayers might throw them out the next election. The taxpayers might also vote to cut the money for the book.
  • #270
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    @Spoiler Taxpayers are a vain, stupid group, evidently.

    The constitution does not directly grant the right to vote. HOWEVER, if a vote is established, ALL citizens (except felons and challenged) must be allowed equal access to vote.

    This country was not formed as a democracy because the founders knew that mob rule is the e4xact opposite of freedom.

    No one who is not a trained educator should have a say in education, both parents and politicians alike. It's why our schools are in trouble.
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  • #58
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    Arresting him seemed really overboard. I've been to school board district meetings in Miami, and when a parent gets out of hand (non physically), he or she is simply escorted outdoors and not allowed back in. This issue seemed personal with this parent. What a waste of taxpayer money by the way!
  • #325
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    I have enough experience navigating the discussion boards and comment threads on the 'net to know that there must be an awful lot more to this story than is being told. Obviously, a school board meeting is NOT the first venue one approaches with such an issue. What happened with the teacher? With the school administration? Is there a history (either with this teacher's inappropriate assignments or this parent's irrational and unreasonably demanding behavior)? There are way too many questions to pass judgment easily. Was he even arrested? How might that look different than being escorted out of the meeting and barred from it? What was he charged with if he was arrested? Typically, arrest records are public... does anybody have a link to his arrest record? SOOO many questions...
  • #415
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    @Nikflorida The points mentioned in your post are valid points, especially if he didn't actually get arrested. However, he was handcuffed. Don't know about that town, but most cities, that's the first step to jail, plus the officer told him he was being arrested. Also, if there was a prior history with this person, the board could have banned him any meeting and this would not have happened. Everythib seemed a bit odd for sure.
  • #399
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    Yet another of the I could just tell this was going to be a Dain "Bramage" Fitzgerald story. Oh, it reads so innpcently. The school is forcing porn on his poor daughter, and by simply exceeding his 2 minute limit he's hauled off in cuffs. Well, that and yelling over people who disagreed with point of view and was repeatedly told to be quiet so others would be allowed to voice their opinions. When one person was speaking in favor of the book Baer kept yelling out that the man's position was , "Absurd.!" He was asked to stop talking and yelled, " "That's fineā€¦It's absurd. Why don't you have me arrested? Why don't we do that as a civics lesson, nice First Amendment Lesson.". The head of the school board simply told him, ""Sir, would you please be respectful of the other people?", to which he replied, ""Like you're respectful of my daughter, right? And my children?". He was asked to leave since he would allow others to speak uninterrupted. Several times nicely and then, and only then, was he handcuffed and taken out of the building. You see, the First Amendment doesn't allow you to interrupt and try to domninate the conversation at public meetings and to block the First Amendment rights of others who are there to speak at the meeting. If he had left when the policeman asked him to, no show, no story, but then that's probably what he wanted in the first place, and the dolts at Fox and Dain "Bramage" scoop it up like right wing meth. BTW: The passage involved a graphic description of a date rape. Great idea to keep your daughter clueless about that because in the right wing bubble it doesn't really happen. It's just poor innocent boys being boys getting a little carried away, getting trapped by loose, provocatively dressed Feminazis hopped up on birth control pills, luring them with their wily ways to purposefully ruin their lives.
  • #433
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    Parents should warn their daughters about the Real World, not school books, but they usually don't. Boys can come across girls who can get them in trouble, too. Not wearing a condom is what get most boys in trouble, that was their choice.
  • #473
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    Sort of hard to tell if that was a "for" or "against" comment on the book that had the scene about date rape. Care to clarify? Condom or not, whether or not a boy wears 10 condoms, or whatever the "reputation" of the girl, date rape is never acceptable under any circumstance. Maybe we need more books in the schools with realistic depictions of date rape, war, and everything else that goes on in the real world so kids are better prepared for it, and will work to change it, instead of living in states of denial like so many of their parents.
  • #244
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    Don't you all get it? Come on, folks, this has been the unwritten rule for almost 13 years. All the trouble they went to to make the conditions ripe for closing our society, and you people don't get the hint by now?

    Anyone who speaks out or questions anything is a traitor. Anyone who raises their voice or protests is a domestic terrorist. Don't you all realize that you need to fall in line an acquiesce? Police at public school meetings are used to stomp these traitors and show everyone what happens when you do not accept authority. That man was lucky he was not beaten like a pulp like the 84 year old Daniel Daley, a WWII vet who got his neck broken for touching a cop.

    This is America. Citizens have no voice and no influence on government policy. Those days are over.
  • #209
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    It's called creating a public disturbing. And ranting about a one page sex scene is LUDICROUS.
    His daughter is old enough that I would wager she didn't learn anything from the book. When will we stop "protecting" teenagers from life?
  • #154
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    The book is entirely suitable for high-school age teens. If you haven't created enough of a rapport and trust with your 13-17 year-old to feel confident he/she can handle PG-13 content......then there is a parenting problem, not a school problem. Your teenage son/daughter will already be dealing with far greater challenges, adversity, and sexual issues or questions on the school grounds at lunchtime or during recess.
  • #384
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    You think that an explicit and violent rape scene is entirely suitable for 14 year olds? My kids, hopefully, will not be "dealing with far greater challenges", nor should they be expected to at age 14. You seem to think that rape is a sex. It is not. It is violence. You are clearly the one with the parenting issue.
  • #89
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    It's long past time for right wing fundamentalist "Christians" to decide what, when, where, how and why the general population is going to be educated, taught to think, and live their lives. He was given the same two minutes as everyone else, and if he could not get it said it that time, then he had no business speaking..
  • #640
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    @jamayla Apparently according to the video they can and they are.Big problem in my opinion.I was almost arrested for chewing out an incredibly rude pharmacist.I then spoke to the owners of the store and they called it all off.It seemed all of the other employees in the store hated her as well.The lady at the window accused me of things I did not do and threatened me for blurting logic and reason.Anyone that believes America is not 75% Communist is 100% wrong.
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