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  • #3
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    No. Community colleges need to educate, not indoctrinate the students with the "welfare state entitlement" mentality.
    Why should they go to school/college when the can stay at home and get their "entitled" welfare?
    "....screw work. I'll sit home and let those dummies who do work pay for me because they are evil and wont give me a fair chance in life. That'll teach the evil workers......"
  • #8
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    sad we have those who think they are owed anything and if they fail they blame others. college needs to be earned not given just like jobs.
  • #4
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    I don't mean to rain on any parades but I believe we need to freeze or cut spending across the board.
  • #17
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    I don't mean to bring a halt to the cut everything parade but until we stop wasting 2.5 billlion dollars a week in a useless war in afghanistan and until we stop throwing millions upon millions of dollars away on useless foreign aid (e.g. tribute) money to countries that hate us, any talk of making or fiscal house right on the back of the poor, the elderly or by shutting down higher education and radio stations is just a lot of hot air.
  • #19
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    @DABurroughs - Freeze the amounts given to the poor, elderly and education and cut defense. I'm game.
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  • #2
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    We need to set up laws in this country that punish companies who export jobs outside the USA. It doesn't matter how well trained the workforce is if companies can get the work done cheaper in India or China and reap tax benefits for doing it the jobs will move out of the country. Training the workforce for jobs that aren't there isn't going to help. Tax laws need to be changed to reward companies that hire inside the USA.
  • #18
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    I agree with your last statement that tax breaks could be setup for companies that hire inside United States, but I do not agree that we need to create new penalties for businesses that don't. I think maybe businesses that I have work forces outside United States should be more transparent so consumers have more knowledge when making a decision on what product to buy
  • #24
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    Not punish, we need to set up laws & policies in this country that attract, create, and keep jobs here, and find a workable balance between funding our socialism programs (e.g. O-care, SS, free phones, etc) and a strong business environment that gives people jobs & opportunity.

    As is, favorable business environments created by low labor costs, manipulated currencies, etc in other countries makes them attractive; just ask Apple. We need to change that, but I don't see it changing in the next 4 years.

    One more thing that would help, no public funding for degree programs that won't come close to qualifying a graduate for a job. It was surprising to me, but Japan is full of US college graduates living in tiny rooms away from family teaching English because after months of searching they couldn't find a job here. Every one I spoke with cited their choice of degree program and US economy as primary causes for going overseas to find work.

    Public funding for these worthless degree programs needs to end.
  • #29
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    @FFX_VA By punish I mean to at least make these companies pay US taxes on the good/services brought back into the US. No tax exemptions/credit for foreign taxes paid. If there are any tariffs levied against good from the countries where the arok was done these companies should have to pay them too.
  • #33
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    I sort of agree. I don't know if you'd call it a "punishment" though. I think there should probably be extra taxes and fees paid to companies that export that make it so there really much of a savings in hiring people outside the US. If they're not saving any money than there's no benefit in exporting. But I do also think education needs to be improved in the US as well. Both are important.
  • #34
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    @PNWest On the surface that sounds like a good idea, but my gut tells me it prob violates s few free trade agreements. Companies pass costs onto consumers, that's the way it works. So under your plan I wonder what an iPhone would cost if we did that? I'd hate to go back to Tin cans with strings, how would I play Politix!
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  • #20
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    Wrong. Tuition goes up when funding goes down. Operating expenses always go up, and the money has to come from somewhere.

    From the liberal Wall Street Journal: " fresh academic research supports the idea that student aid in the form of grants leads to higher prices at for-profit schools, a small segment of postsecondary education.

    The study's authors warned their findings don't apply to public colleges and private nonprofit schools, which they say are different because they aren't motivated by profits and because their prices are largely determined by state funding and donations.

    A spokesman for Education Secretary Arne Duncan said the administration believes there is a link between federal aid and tuition increases at for-profit schools, but that it sees no such tie with public and nonprofit schools."

    So you might be right if you plan to go to a for-profit school to study cosmetology, but probably not if you plan to go to Stanford to study engineering.
  • #14
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    More programs for community colleges sounds good, but I would like to see more in the way of trade schools. Not everyone is a college bound student, but with good trade schools young and old could get careers going or train for new careers.
  • #48
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    Most community colleges ARE trade schools. Electricians, plumbers, auto mechanics, nurses, medical and dental assistants . . . all of these skills are taught at community colleges.
  • #13
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    no more funding,throwing money down a rat hole is a proven failure,it should be a little hardship to go to college,maybe then the ones that go will take their opportunity more seriously,you also need to wipe out most of the liberal arts programs from any kind of grant ,loan or scholarship and focus these monies on useful career oriented courses.no more scholar ships for being able to catch a ball or Frisbee{ My dog can do that should he get a scholarship}.no unsecured loans,if you know its going to cost you,you will put forth more effort.if you do get a scholar ship and don't complete the course,you should pay ETC
  • #47
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    Ok Mongo, you are making way too much sense here! Are you saying that students must take total responsibility for their educational expenses? Wow....I'm all for it. And I don't care if they want to master in basket weaving, as long as they understand that they have to ultimately pay for that decision! How do we get them to pay it back? No more tax refunds, no "entitlement" programs, no Government secured loans, NO forgiveness of said loans .....until it's paid back in full!
  • #12
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    No. There is a false assumption that everyone needs a college degree. Not everyone should have a college degree.

    What I am not hearing is anything about, help for trade schools. If you want to rebuild this country, those with college degrees are less likely to do it. Those who go to trade schools are the ones who will do the hard work to rebuild. THAT is the middle class...the people who use their hands and their heads. Not the intellectual do-nothings.
  • #28
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    First, most of the time (at least around here) trade schools and community colleges are the same thing. Want to be a welder, electrician, plumber, etc...? You go to the local community college unless you took vocational classes in high school (which I think needs to receive greater focus).
    If we want to remain a first world country with a strong middle class we need hands on blue collar workers. We also need engineers, programmers, IT professionals, teachers, etc... I saw a report recently about how we are sorely in need of nurses. Guess where we get many of our nurses? Yup, community college.
  • #10
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    All education needs more funding with stricter conditions attached that reward results. The systems, whether they be community colleges or primary and secondary education should be held accountable and show they deserve more money.
  • #5
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    Do community colleges need more government funding?

    Better question; How much more can we borrow before we collapse under the weight of our debt?(Assuming that we haven't reached the point of collapse already.)
  • #65
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    I'm basically for 2 year community colleges as they offer practical courses to start people on the higher learning path on affordable budgets. Of course vocational courses are highly desired for those who just want a trade, even if it's just to start out their careers. I had to go to another state to get vocational courses. There was nothing but colleges in the immediate area. I could not afford to go to them and some of the colleges had courses that where mostly bullshit like a local liberal arts college.

    I don't think we need to throw more money at educational institutions. Between the 1970-71 school year and 2006-07, inflation-adjusted US public-school spending more than doubled, from $5,593 to $12,463 per pupil, a whopping 123% increase that bought lots of teachers, administrators, and other shiny things!. The number of staff per pupil ballooned about 70%. But according to scores on the National Assessment of Educational Progress, the Nation's Report Card, test scores for 17-year-olds, essentially, our schools' "final products", remained almost completely unchanged. In 1973, their average math score was 304 (out of 500). In 2008 it was just 306. In reading, their average score in 1971 was 285. In 2008 it was just 286.

    So we should throw more money for this lackluster performance? Like we need more bureaucracy for more efficient government? This is how communism works, a government apparatchik for every worker.

    What is needed is stop being so PC with education and get back to learning basics. Baseline teachers are so hamstrung it's a wonder they can teach at all. Stop basing education on feelgood fairness and artificial equality scoring. If you lose then get some better gumption to improve. Students never had it so good with resources.
  • #61
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    On the subject of community colleges, these institutions have become, over the last couple of decades, a depository for kids looking for a second chance at high school. Kids who didn't do well in high school and are basically covering the same skills at community college before they attempt a university setting.

    This tells me something is wrong in high school. There should not be remedial classes in a college setting. Secondary school is there to teach the basics and apparently it is not because ALL colleges are filled with students in remedial classes. So we need to rethink secondary education and how it is NOT fulfilling the needs of ALL students.

    Community college needs to become more trade and technical than academic. Our local community college makes so much money on AA degrees it doesn't need to offer much in the way of trade classes. Of course, trade equals hands-on and hands-on equals more cost than book learning type classes, but trades are going to be the next be boom in the employment market. We need many MORE trade schools than there are and they need to offer a wider array of opportunities.

    Young people today may not realize it, but if they opt for 4 year degrees they may end up underemployed and deep in debt. Those people who don't mind getting their hands dirty are the ones who are going to be getting the jobs.
  • #56
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    We need to be careful not to let our schools and colleges become job training centers only.
    We also need to produce a lot people who are prepared to be intelligent citizens.
  • #66
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    @PayThatCEO Don't be an idiot, and don't search for reasons to be offended.
    I mean that everyone should be afforded an education that not only prepares them for a trade or profession, but that also gives them the tools they need to be able to pick out the BS from the truth in political discourse.
    Enough math to understand economics and compound growth, enough science to not fall for the deliberate confusion sowed by special interests, enough sociology to understand the class and social structure, enough logic to know when someone is blowing smoke up your ass, enough history to understand how we got where we are and where we're headed, and enough english so that they can read and understand information from every source.
    In short, everyone should get what used to be called a liberal arts education.
  • #50
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    I am new to this "party", however I have heard grumblings amongst college students that there is now a cap on financial aid (i.e. Pell Grants) received. How does that play in funding for colleges? Or is what I am speaking of a whole 'nother creature?
  • #43
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    The dumbing down of America is intention. It's easier to control people (see the Bible Belt) by withholding quality education, blaming the "other party" and telling people It's OK, they're gonna have a blast in Heaven. Just suffer on dumbos.
  • #35
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    I know this is a way out there idea. It would never fly with most people, and there's absolutely no way to implement it even if there was some sort of following for it, so I'm just saying this as an idea that I've had for a long time and realize it will never happen. Nor do I expect a good response to this from Liberals and Conservatives alike but... here it goes anyway.

    I've always felt mandatory public education should start at age 6 months old and go all the way to age 20 (respectively), and that rather than have separate schools (pre-school, elementary, jr high, high, and community college) it should be one large school without actual grades but several classes at different levels, separated into the different subjects (jr high and high school style) where children are tested every 6 months (obviously aged 6 months to something like 2 would be handled a little differently), and put in the level they are qualified to handle and earn credits for each level they achieve and graduate based on the when they manage to complete the proper amount of credits in each subject, some would graduate before age 20, but each child graduating with the equivalent of an AA degree, that would include completion of a couple of mandated real world experience jobs / internships where students must work both a customer service type job for at least a year and then also a higher career choice internship based on their interest. Then after graduation, depending on their age (between 16 and 20), should be mandated to serve at least 4 to 6 years in the military (this goes for both men and women) which will include training in a specific field and then after this time is completed, they can make the choice as to whether or not they want to remain in the military, pursue higher education or seek employment.

    This isn't a complete idea, mainly because I know it won't happen anyway. But it's just a nutty idea I've tossed around for quite some time.
  • #37
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    AA wasn't really correct, what I meant was Associates, it doesn't necessarily have to be an Associates in Arts.
  • #39
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    Obviously you have thought about this some. I did have a question. Why 6 months?

    ......... This almost sounds like the type of education many of the lucky few rec'd back in the middle ages or many in the Far East.
  • #52
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    @MRMacrum Most pre-schools start kids at 6 months of age. I think kids, when exposed to other kids who are a little older start absorbing information faster. Again this isn't really a complete idea and maybe at such an age it shouldn't be considered mandatory. But I would think at that age you'd start grouping the kids based on those who can't crawl, can crawl, and walk and use educational tools that teach in a very basic way colors, letter sounds, shapes, maybe even my baby can read (for a little older). My basic idea behind this is kids can learn at their own pace and not be pressured to keep up with, or be held back, by their age group, and can learn at a lower level in a subject they're not as good at without feeling like they're being left behind, but also be put in a higher class and play to their strengths.

    My son is in kindergarten right now. I'm so frustrated with the public school system but I have friends who have kids in private school and I just don't see anything special about that either. My solution is that I have a private tutor 2 xs a week for my son. He's doing multiplication with his tutor but bringing home basic addition for his homework at school. His reading, however, is a little more difficult for him, again the tutor is working with him on that, and he's pretty much caught up to his class. Because he's not ahead of his class in reading, however, he can't be pushed up to the next grade. It's just frustrating. I feel if they has separate classes for each subject and just placed in a class based on where he tests in each subject, he could be doing the appropriate work at school.
  • #55
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    @TrueAtheist - I guess I am at a loss here wondering why the current fad of kids accelerating through the learning process. Although now that I think about it, my parents had me reading well beyond 2nd grade before I hit kindergarten. And though it is frustrating, it seems that if parents want to make the best of the education that is available, they need to be part of it first and foremost. I experienced 12 different schools in 8 different parts of the country and world growing up. And all through that somewhat chaotic experience, my parents were there pushing me to do my best and expecting it. As long as you are frustrated, that means you too are making yourself part of your child's education.
  • #57
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    @MRMacrum Maybe you're right and maybe I'll never really be fully satisfied no matter what the quality of education is. But I do feel that the education system could be better. = / . Thanks though, I feel you paid you a great compliment. =)
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  • #23
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    "We already have lots of well educated people living in poverty."

    ......... I guess a better scenario is to have lots of uneducated people living in poverty.......Oh wait. Seems we may have both.
  • #26
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    @hwyangel - I have seen the movie and it is compelling. But do we give up? Or as a society find a way to pick them up. Education is one part of the answer. Creating opportunity is another.
  • #27
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    @MRMacrum
    College can help but it doesn't do much good if people are illiterate or don't finish high school. And even welfare can help for immediate issues, but the money always ends up across town in the hands of wealthy business owners. The best way to truly help the poor is to build up the poor neighborhoods. Better schools, community centers, and resident run businesses that keep funds in the neighborhood.
  • #30
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    @hwyangel Wherever there are resident run businesses that keep funds in the neighborhood, there are Wal-Marts ready to be built to remove those funds.
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