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  • #3
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    There is absolutely no reason for us to be giving Uganda aid. And don't come back at me with the old "humanitarian aid" because obviously that money is not working.
  • #1
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    I don't care what they do but we shouldn't be sending them money regardless of how they feel about that. Take that 1.8 billion dollars and start paying our debt off.
  • #6
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    Government has enough to do without involving itself in personal choices. As for the Church, its response should be one of education and compassion. The condemnation for homosexuality, as with any other sin, is complete. But, the opportunity for redemption and forgiveness is just as relevant as it is with all the sinners that attend church every weekend.
  • #15
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    This isn't "condemning" homosexuality.
    These religious leaders are in favor for genocide. That goes to how their moral compass for compassion..
  • #28
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    @Cool_voter -(your misrepresentations aside) When the stove top is red hot and you see a child reach for it, is it compassionate to let the child burn?

    That being said, it has long been recognized (at least in this country) that the relationship between God and man should not be interfered with by governments. However, to muddy things up, the prosecution of pedophiles, the spreading of HIV and the exploitation of the disabled should definitely be included in the purview of government authority.
  • #32
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    @DerivePI
    So you think killing gays is alright?

    I wish you'd say that to your gods face.
    He's smite the sh!t out of you.
  • #49
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    @Cool_voter - OK, I guess I will need to address your misrepresentations:---

    "These religious leaders are in favor of genocide" - Even Mary found it necessary to note "Fischer's Twitter feed makes clear that he thinks the "kill the gays" provision has been removed." She is very good at writing on the line between truth and liberal propaganda and exceeding that boundary, as you clearly do is worse than disingenious.---

    "So you think killing gays is alright?" - A clear use of False Attribution. You should get a job at the Levitt Institute.
  • #64
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    @DerivePI "Fischer's Twitter feed makes clear that he thinks the "kill the gays" provision has been removed." Doesn't say whether or not he's in favor of the death penalty for gays, just that he understands that provision is no longer part of the Ugandan anti-gay legislation.

    IMO, anyone who claims to be a follower of Christ should be condemming not only the Ugandan government, but most especially Bryan Fischer and Tony Perkins and their organizations. Silence is complicity.
  • #2
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    We have sufficient issues here to be concerned with. Evangelicals are supposed to be religious leaders not political tools.

    "Kill the Gays" isn't a great idea in my books, but Uganda has plenty of other problems we seem more than happy to stay out of.... Why is that?
  • #27
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    @Cool_voter I agree to a point. Here's a problem we ALWAYS run into.... Christian values and ethics(?) are meaningful to Christians; the rub is, not everyone is Christian.

    Muslems don't give anymore thought to Christian standards than Christians do about Buddist or Druid standards.

    As for what would Jesus say? We don't REALLY know, last time I checked he's still dead.

    There are those who would argue homosexuality is against the christian value system while others , like you, who see killing to be more of an issue.
  • #30
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    @Sharpshooter
    @Sharpshooter all sin is against Christianity.
    Jesus was ok with hookers, he married one.
    Why can't the rest of his followed get over gays...

    And we do know what he would say, actually.
    Do unto others as you would want done to you.
    Love thy neighbor
    Love thy enemy.
    Turn the other cheek.
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  • #142
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    @woodtick57
    Actually, Christians worship the same God that you will now down and worship at the judgement, did you know there are no unbelievers in Hell? They just believed in him too late! When I said read up on difference in the God of Christianity vs other religion's gods I meant study it, not see that it's spelled the same a draw a conclusion
  • #8
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    Killing seems kinda harsh.

    Why are we concerned with Ugandan anything? Like we don't have our own issue's to deal with.
  • #86
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    @Cool_voter guess I will die then.
    However gay is not a religion, yet!
    I don't care who is gay or not. But thats Uganda's law.
    What does America have to do with it, we git plenty of issues here in the USA and plenty of Americans want other peoples money. Why don't we give them some of that money we waste trying to interfere in what other countries are doing?
  • #111
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    @Thegrif the point is Christian Americans are funding this.
    Killing gays in Uganda won't help. American FAIMLY values.
  • #156
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    @Cool_voter some christians may be do some killin of gays, not me and not a lot of others either. So lets not just throw a blanket of gay killer on all Christians. I think in any sub set of any society (like Christians), there are some good and some bad. Like some cops are really good, and some are not. I personally don't believe in killing unless it's to protect life from death or great bodily harm, or a deer at hunting season or a gator at gator season, those last 2 are food.
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  • #7
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    This just reinforces my low opinion and total lack of respect for anything coming from the Extreme Evangelical Right in this country.
  • #13
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    Just because this story is written to make it look like Christians in the US forced Uganda to pass such a law doesn't make it so. It's a pity you don't recognize Christophobia when you see it.
    Homosexuality is a sin, however it is no worse than any other sin such as theft, adultry, or murder. In God's sight they are all equal and all forgivable if the repentence is genuine. You cannot judge all of Christianity by the Fred Phelps types or the hatred from the leftists.
  • #19
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    @Realthinker the story wasn't written to make christians look bad.
    Christians in the us, specifically ones in power, are in favor of eliminating an entire people, because they don't groove with your ideals.
    What if there was a kill the Christians bill?
    Now how can you see this being anything but religious people once again being ok with violence against a group you don't agree with...
  • #26
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    @Realthinker - And where in my comment did I condemn all of Christianity. Perhaps you are too sensitive to "any" criticism of the folks of the Religious Right. Notice I wrote "Extreme Evangelical Right in this country." I would hope you would agree that this particular arm of Christianity represents a token number of the Christian faithful in this country. I certainly hope so. From the church goers I interact with, this seems to be the case. Most are reasonable live and let live type folks. Unfortunately, the faithful have , like the Muslim world< allowed their extremes to take over their message in quite a few cases.

    And I did not think these Christian fundies "forced" Uganda to do anything. It is their implicit endorsement I find totally obnoxious.
  • #29
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    @Cool_voter Where did you get an idea like that? Just which "Christians" in "poer" are in favor of eliminating an entire people?
  • #33
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    @Realthinker the Christians in power that are supporting a bill to kill all the gays.
    Did you read the article.
    Can you read at all?
    Is it really Thursday?
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  • #4
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    This is a Ugandan issue. Their cultural, legal, and religious tendancies will decide what is done here. The US Evangelicals are only there if the Ugandans allow them to be. Having worked in Africa for a few years, I can tell you that every situation in any of these countries can become volitile at any given moment. So, the Evangelicals are better off if they just keep quiet...otherwise they may be kicked out...or worse.
  • #95
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    Evangelicals, aka, Fundamentalists, aka Bible Thumpers, are no different in their hardline views of Christianity than the Jihadists of Islam. Both think it's ok to kill gays.
  • #92
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    Reading the liberal leftist rag "Rolling Stone" give me a break
    They hate America....OMG
    Leftists aim to destroy this country anyway.
  • #100
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    @Vance1

    Did you check out the article on people using socialism without understanding what it is? For years i have asked you to use it correctly, and you still can't...
  • #109
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    @woodtick57
    I use it right all of the time, BUT you seek it so you try to defer from the actual truth.
    its what liberal leftists do.
    You seek complete Government control , just admit it
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  • #79
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    Gay or not we don't need to be giving them nearly 2 million in aid yearly. We need to stay the hell out of their business, Obama has enough on his plate at home that he hasn't even touched yet. Let these people deal with their own freaks.
  • #74
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    Having tried to address my comments directly to the editors and been prevented from doing so because the website says the direct access email is not activated, I am forced to make my comments more public than I would choose.
    It is my contention that Mary Noble's choice of a headline for her piece is designed to influence the readers before they get to the article. The headline reads as though two American Christian men are behind the Uganda law, i.e.. they have "ties" to the law, when in fact they have an opinion about the law with which most of us disagree. Such a practice is referred to as "yellow journalism".
    Furthermore, an opinion about a law that makes a practice illegal is not the same thing as encouraging the death penalty be applied to the law, which Ms. Noble's article infers.
    Describing these two individuals as "powerful" is a further distortion of the facts, giving them far more influence than they actually have. They do have a right to their opinion whether we agree with them or not.
    I believe Ms. Noble's article was intended to stir up hatred against the Christians and request that it be removed.
  • #104
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    @Realthinker you could always research christian groups influence in Uganda on your own. you know htey have influence on the laws here. why is it such a stretch to believe they have influence on the laws there?

    it isn't even a matter of belief, it is clearly shown in the facts of who is pushing this law ...
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  • #34
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    After reading these comments I find myself wondering where all these concerned liberals were when Idi Amin was butchering more than a million of his own people in Uganda? Where was this outrage when the Tutsi massacred nearly a million Hutu in Rwanda? Or during the long line of warlords who have systematically made the Congo a killing field of massive proportions? Why are you not equally screaming about the atrocities in Sierre Leon, Liberia and Nigeria? You may well have been saying the same thing you're saying today but nothing was done and nothing will be done here because other than verbal condemnation and the cutting off of aid (both of which should be done since no aid goes anywhere in Africa except Swiss bank accounts) there is nothing that can be done. I don't understand where the vitriol is coming from? Is it because the targeted are gays? How are gay lives any more important than the multi millions who have slaughtered in Africa over the past 50 years? We've done nothing about all those other things and we will do nothing about this. My suggestion is that our government yank the passports of those religious organizations fanning the flames here but then that would mean that hundreds of thousands of kids go hungry and perhaps die of starvation? So what is the solution? Other than just ranting on Politix?
  • #76
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    Not sure why you bring up old news. Certainly there were and still are loud voices condemning the innumerable tragedies that are a fact of life in many parts of Africa and elsewhere. The recent muzzling of US righteous indignation I think can be blamed on our current focus on things domestic. Unfortunately loud voices do little if government does nothing in response. And frankly Africa is a continent that is and will be left to its own devices for the most part. It is not right , but there it is. Personally I feel that the US has tried to shoulder more than its fair share of humanitarian causes in recent years. It is time for the rest of the developed world to pick up some of our slack and even maybe step it up some. I am tired of our country being "expected" to do something in every tragic occurrence out there. We have our own more local problems to work through at the moment.
  • #81
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    @MRMacrum I read you and respect your opinions but on this one you're confusing me. We both know why our government does little in Africa other than in oil producing countries. OIL. And big oil is one of the corporations that actually run America. In other words there is no financial gain for them in most of Africa. It's hard to speak to Africa because if I said the same thing about an African country that I would say about say Estonia ( a white country) I will be instantly labeled a racist. But I'm going to say it anyhow and hope that you understand what I'm getting at. Africa is as tribal as any place on earth. They simply do not accept that tribes can get along. They never have. Despite strong mineral wealth the Congo has been a succession of dictators and massacres and atrocities since I was a child more than 60 years ago. Yet it doesn't seem to be putting much of dent in their overpopulation. And that wealth is never used to benefit the people. All the outside influence in the world hasn't changed that. UN troops have been in the Congo off and on for decades. Nothing works. The same for numerous other African countries.

    Bill Gates has poured literally billions into African nations trying to teach them to modernize. Where are the results? We give every single nation there "aid" and it goes to the dictators banks and things go on pretty much as they always have. In the Muslim third worlds they war over religion. On coastal Africa (Nigeria and so on) they war over religion and the rest just war. But so do we. The difference is I guess the level of sophistication of weaponry and the level of propaganda on selling war. But you confuse me when you say "it's not right" that Africa is left to their own devices. Trillions have been given to various countries and yet nothing changes. I don't understand what you think should be done and then you turn around and say you're sick of meddling and that we have more domestic problems. I agree with the latter part but I don't agree that Africa should be intervened in by any country. To my way of thinking the situation in Africa is a giant example of the statement "for an addict to break a habit they first must want to break the habit". I don't see Africa changing. The situation in South Africa since the end of apartheid now finds blacks in the majority at the same level of poverty as they were under whites. The thieves in charge are now black. Only real difference.

    You're obviously an intelligent man. I'm old and my education is dated. Maybe I'm just missing solutions a younger person can see but for the world of me, I don't see what the point is in pouring money and effort into Africa beyond what is being done. They massacre each other by the millions and still starve to death because of over population. Gates and the WHO have spend billions trying to stem HIV but it continues rampant because of married men who frequent prostitutes and then take it home. It's 10 times worse than here. You give them grain and some rebel group takes the grain by force. It's a quagmire and I don't see the solution.
  • #90
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    @jessejaymes - I think we are more on the same page than you think. I too have had a life time of witnessing Africa struggle. A combination of built in tribal issues and outside exploitation has created a continent that seems to be intent on continuing a downward spiral. I also have no clue what to do. And I think neither does the US government other than to get in the same exploitation line with the rest of the developed countries. It is not right. But until the Africans realize that their petty tribal and religious stupidity is gaining them nothing while giving away the very resources that could make them rise in the global economy. Until they find leaders who are for them instead of exploiting them they will be condemned to the pitiful existence that makes up many of the lives over there.

    I just wish do gooders from other nations would stop expecting the US to take the lead all the time.

    And no, I do not take your comments as racist. I hope you did not take mine that way either. The issue is definitely wrapped around race for some, but not me.
  • #97
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    @MRMacrum We're totally in agreement that the USA needs to stop trying to be all things to all people.
  • #62
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    @Denizen_Kate that's exactly right.
    Start taxing the churches, because they are so politically active these days, stop sending foreign aid to everyone, And stop this "Christian nations shit"
  • #87
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    To Denizen and Cool Voter, here's a real simple solution to that: Cut their foreign aid. They can have their anti-gay agenda, we save taxpayer dollars, win win.
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  • #159
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    See this is why we need to as a society need to exterminate organized. I'm talking militant anti-religious atheism. All of this bible thumping bs in dangerous. People always say "well what harm does religion do?" Look at people like Fred Phelps, Rick Santorum, Adolf Hitler, Iran, Fransisco Franco, etc. This is what Christianity brings to the world. Hate, bigotry, intolerant, anti-science, homophobia, racism, etc. and Americans are sick of it.

    How would evengicals feel if the USA tried to pass a "Kill the Evangelicals" bill? Evangelicals and Uganda are basically no better than Nazi Germany.
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  • #129
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    What’s the problem, we have been sending money to Egypt for years. I see a couple of Christians may have ties to the situation.
  • #116
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    As an Evangelical, I can tell you that most evangelicals don't even know about this, and those who do are appalled. For the most part we are against gay marriage, sure. However, some sins are just between man and God, and this would be one of them. Killing Gays is not okay by scripture.
  • #134
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    @woodtick57 There is a difference between ancient Israel's government laws and God's laws for all people after the New Covenant. Israel's Government laws said to stone adulterers too, but when Jesus came he stopped them and said "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone."
  • #144
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    @DyingBreed

    So did god change his mind?(jesus and god were one and the same, remember?) or was he wrong in the first place? Seems like quite the theological conundrum either way....
  • #155
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    @woodtick57 No, of course he didn't. In one case he was making laws for the nation of Israel, in the other he was laying principles for men to live their lives by.
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