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  • #18
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    I am a Christian and I agree. When you have a government that constantly attacks Christianity on one hand and then embellishes the Muslim faith on the other Christianity will always lose.
  • #21
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    That is one of the most ridiculous things I've ever read on this site.

    Please give some examples of government 'constantly' attacking Christianity and a few of the government 'embellishing' Muslim faith.
  • #26
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    Attacks Christianity? I'd ask, but I really don't care. My concern is how Christians attack religions not Christian-see Mufreesboro, TN.
  • #32
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    @PNWest Taking the 10 commandments out of schools yet having classes on the Muslim faith-displaying Muslim attire while attacking second amendment clothing apparel. Just a few examples. Schools are teaching alternate theories on evolution but are not allowed to suggest God? This is happening everywhere if you pay attention to the news outlets that are allowed to report it. Even the POTUS has shown more bias towards the Muslim faith than Christians. You don't see Obama backing any Christian faithed people yet he's dumping billions into Muslim faithed countries. The facts are there!
  • #63
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    @PNWest
    Piss Christ -- NEA aka public taxes
    vs
    South Park --- banned from their Muhammed skit.

    You've got the DoD claiming Catholics are as dangerous as Al Queda.(no I'm not Catholic)
  • #73
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    @MadAmerican
    Not indoctrinating children into Christianity is not an attack on it. I don't know enough about the Islamic classes you are speaking of (if it's advocating Islam in anyway, then I'm against it, but there's nothing wrong with educating children about the history of a religion.) Evolution is taught in school because it is an actual scientific theory. God is NOT a theory and is not supported by any form of science.

    I'm a strong supporter of the second amendment. Punishing kids for displaying guns on their clothes is horrible. However, how the literal, yet nonexistent hell, do guns have anything to do with Christianity?

    Finally, the Muslim countries receive the most foreign aid because they are among the most underdeveloped. We don't look at the countries we aid to make sure they're the right religion.(Not that I support foreign aid.)
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  • #4
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    It's good to know more people are choosing facts and logic over faith and belief. Because Jesus isn't going to save America, and Neither is Muhammad. The faster people use reasoning to solve their problems, and control their life, the faster we can become a more advanced, enlightened society.
  • #102
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    I do not believe you should refuse to use a screwdriver just because a bunch of idiots choose to stab themselves in the eye with it. My faith and belief coexist with facts and logic, we really know very little about ourselves or the universe... religion is a tool humans have almost always used to make some sort of sense out of what we don't understand.
  • #106
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    @MarkColwell I understand what you mean. But we understand a lot more now then the followers of Abrahamic religions did 2000 years ago. They created God's and stories to explain rain, death, sunrise etc. We're more intelligent than they were. We should look to the earth instead of the skies for our answers. There are questions in the universe that still exist, but I think it would be more beneficial to us as a people to try to find out those things rather than use religion as an explanation. Some questions will never be answered, and I'm ok with that.
  • #113
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    I'm going to play Devils advocate here and defend those beliefs (even though they are not my own.) The stories I read and hear do not do a very good job explaining rain, death or sunrise... they do seem to do a pretty good job explaining how to be a good person. In that area, I submit we have not really advanced a whole heck of a lot beyond: "Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you."
  • #128
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    @MarkColwell OMG, when are atheists going to realize you can have faith and still use logic and facts to arrive at that conclusion! I'm in Med school and the guy that continually sets the bar in almost every exam is a devout Mormon, faith had nothing to do with how intelligent you are,it has to do with personal experience, which is an entirely different ways of gathering information and just as useful! Every major study ever conducted shows Huge correlation between religious belief and overall health and well being, so there are the facts!! By the way it doesn't even mean you have room be religious to benefit,but some type of spiritual growth is very very healthy and a natural part of the human condition. To diminish that would be a major mistake and we are already seeing the consequences across the board,more mental health issues, self indulgent behaviors, irresponsible parenting, disrespectful kids,self centered adults, narcissism and the lists goes on! So believe what you want, but don't try to pretend a culture of non believers would somehow be better for society as a whole, not even close!
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  • #54
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    I'd agree, so long as every corporation and tax exempt group were treated the same.

    Why is Harvard's $30 billion untaxed?
  • #143
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    @stepped_in_it Guess you missed this part?

    "every corporation and tax exempt group were treated the same"

    Eliminate it all, get it? Yeah, HuffPo, great source. Let's see if I can find some John Birch stuff, eh?
  • #328
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    @gjsmith_62 I'm not so sure about taxing religious groups. I mean, what's to stop politicians that may disagree with one particular religion they see as threatening and move to hike unfair taxes on it?
  • #331
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    @cdman I tend to agree, but at this point, seems too many get tax exempt status, e.g., Harvard, why?

    That the left twists the meaning of 501c3 is criminal, so eliminate all of this shinola.
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  • #5
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    The only culture war out there is the one that evangelicals like Moore have been waging to force their religious views into our courtrooms and classrooms. Moore and all of his followers are free to believe whatever they choose and to lead their lives how ever they want. No one is stopping them.

    On the other hand people like Moore do not have the right to impose their beliefs on anyone else. I for one wish they would stop this as it gives Christians a bad name.
  • #58
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    Get back when the religious orthodoxy of "here and now" is no longer taught in schools. " I for one wish they would stop" teaching moral relativity.
  • #72
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    the is Barry Goldwater. 1981 shortly after he said he wanted to kick Jerry Fawell in the nuts for trying to block Sanda day O'Conner's nomination to SCOTUS.
    Just more of the same Evangelical BS"
    "On religious issues there can be little or no compromise. There is no position on which people are so immovable as their religious beliefs. There is no more powerful ally one can claim in a debate than Jesus Christ, or God, or Allah, or whatever one calls this supreme being. But like any powerful weapon, the use of God's name on one's behalf should be used sparingly. The religious factions that are growing throughout our land are not using their religious clout with wisdom. They are trying to force government leaders into following their position 100 percent. If you disagree with these religious groups on a particular moral issue, they complain, they threaten you with a loss of money or votes or both.
    I'm frankly sick and tired of the political preachers across this country telling me as a citizen that if I want to be a moral person, I must believe in "A," "B," "C" and "D." Just who do they think they are? And from where do they presume to claim the right to dictate their moral beliefs to me?
    And I am even more angry as a legislator who must endure the threats of every religious group who thinks it has some God-granted right to control my vote on every roll call in the Senate. I am warning them today: I will fight them every step of the way if they try to dictate their moral convictions to all Americans in the name of conservatism."
    Speech in the US Senate (16 September 1981)
  • #76
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    "Christians must return to the days when they were a moral example and vanguard - defenders of belief in a larger unbelieving culture,"
    I guess perhaps he wants to bring burning witches back? Just what time frame is he wanting to return to? The one where you didn't have to sit across the church aisle from blacks because they had their own churches? The time when women knew their place in the kitchen and were totally submissive to their husbands whom they were married off to at 15? The time when gays knew their place and it was in the closet and in the catholic priesthood?
  • #171
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    @Denizen_Kate Why don't you tell me? Is it anything more than "here and now"?

    Now, why not define the differences between phyletic gradualism vs punctuated equilibrium.

    It's science, right?
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  • #8
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    You have to really step back and reconsider any belief structure that demonizes knowledge. The Bible ethically falls apart not when Eve bites the apple, but when the tree of knowledge was forbidden.
  • #30
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    Or more accurately: Beware of any belief structure that values secrets (especially when punishment is tied to those secrets) Why would the knowledge of good and evil be privileged knowledge? Is that ever justified? Bullshit detectors are free and come in every child. More people should use them.
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  • #1
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    There shouldn't have been a "war" to begin with. Both sides claim to be so tolerant and blame the other side for not being tolerant, so what are we left with?
  • #27
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    It's misleading to refer to a "culture war" when the actual failure was the fundamentalist effort to codify superstitions and restrict the liberty of those who disagree. And that is a very good thing.
  • #67
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    Care to name the Congressional bill that would codify "superstitions and restrict the liberty of those who disagree"?
  • #87
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    @gjsmith_62 How about actual laws? DOMA, although defunct, comes to mind. Laws restricting stem cell research are a good example. The various Personhood bills are another. Anti-abortion laws are the classic example of course, but we still, in the 21st century, have anti-blasphemy laws on the books, like this one from a liberal state, "Massachusetts General Law Section 36: "Whoever willfully blasphemes the holy name of God by denying, cursing or contumeliously reproaching God, his creation, government or final judging of the world, or by cursing or contumeliously reproaching Jesus Christ or the Holy Ghost, or by cursing or contumeliously reproaching or exposing to contempt and ridicule, the holy word of God contained in the holy scriptures shall be punished by imprisonment in jail for not more than one year or by a fine of not more than three hundred dollars, and may also be bound to good behavior."

    Fortunately, the Founders built well the law separating the proselytizing urge of some Christians from the rest of us. For instance, Bloomberg reports that strict anti-abortion laws - 7 signed by Republican governors - have been overturned in 8 separate court cases http://goo.gl/yhxUDe
  • #94
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    @DARSB And every blue law on the books. No alcohol sales on Sundays. Oh judges in Tennessee changing babies names. The list of interference in personal freedoms is endless.
  • #145
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    @DARSB Knew you'd go there. Look up the etymology of the word marriage and stop trying to redefine every aspect of life to suit your whims.

    Abortion destroys a life, no two ways about it, are you that slow it takes you five months to make up your mind? Sure you want to procreate?

    State law, go back and read what I'd specified as legitimate context.

    Fortunately you have no concept of the First amendments actual text.
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  • #23
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    Christians have lost no culture war. The losers are all Americans. When we see over 70% of Black children living with no father or mother, who lost the culture war? When we see so many white children living with no father or mother, who lost the culture war? When we see late term babies being aborted & have a sitting President who thinks it is ok to end a child's life after a botched late term abortion, who has lost the culture war? Americans have lost the freedoms to choose to have a school prayer if the community supports it. College grads are told they can not mention God in their graduation speech (UNBELIEVABLE). Americans are told they can not spank their children or fear being arrested. Americans are now being forced to buy healthcare no matter how healthy they are. Americans are being FORCED to pay for other's abortions no matter how much they abhor Abortion. Can you even grasp the depth of arrogance & gull Liberal Democrats have while stripping our freedoms? These Liberal Democrats are the same people who are trying to take away our right to protect ourselves while we have even kids killing us for no reason. America has lost the culture war, not Christians.
  • #40
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    "When we see over 70% of Black children living with no father or mother, who lost the culture war?"

    Since the overwhelming majority of blacks are Christian...

    "Americans are told they can not spank their children or fear being arrested."

    There's no law against spanking your child. There are laws against child ABUSE.

    "Americans are now being forced to buy healthcare no matter how healthy they are."

    Because the alternative is hospitals jacking up prices on everyone else to make up the costs of the ER bills from the uninsured. Making people pay for their own healthcare instead of taking from others is very in line with the general right wing ideology.

    "Americans are being FORCED to pay for other's abortions no matter how much they abhor Abortion."

    I abhor religion. Why do I have to pay for churches getting tax breaks?
  • #57
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    @commonsense51
    Yeah. I'm sure it has nothing to do with the fact that you don't actually have a rebuttal for anything I said.
  • #99
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    @Saving_USA To hear any person make the statement he abhors religion, that person is worthy of no debate. Imagine me saying I abhor Gays or I abhor Black people. That would make me a bigot like you & then I would have to ignore myself.
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  • #24
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    The minister is right about one thing, not so much the church, but in the end, Christians will be a "prophetic minority."---

    "Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.” Matt. 7:13-14

    We live in perilous times, and those with a modicum of perception can see whats coming down the road---

    "But mark this: There will be terrible times in the last days. People will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boastful, proud, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy, without love, unforgiving, slanderous, without self-control, brutal, not lovers of the good, treacherous, rash, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God— having a form of godliness but denying its power. Have nothing to do with such people." 2 Tim. 3:1-5
  • #45
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    @PauldenZangpo

    You won't have to worry about it much longer. Society has slowly disintegrated over the Melania, as prophesied. So enjoy your 3 score and 7 (+ or -) while you can. <wink>
  • #181
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    @PauldenZangpo

    Hold on to that thought....
    “If you're really a mean person you're going to come back as a fly and eat manure.” <wink>
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  • #33
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    To many things the Christians have as bedrock positions are no longer part of our law or culture. The list need only start with two, gay marriage and abortion. No more proof is needed.
  • #29
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    Do you think Christians have now lost the 'culture war'? I say NO we haven't.
    Since Christians overwhelmingly are in higher #'s than Atheists.

    Its right now just that Christians get very little press or media, Because they are being blocked by the liberal anti religion Marxist atheists media.
  • #37
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    The liberal anti religion marxist atheist media lol.. You got that line listening to right wing media. It is ironic that the radio is bombarded by rightwingers saying the media is all left. Most people thought the world was flat and they were wrong. There is no god , not yours or anyone elses. Grow up. Imaginary friends are for children.
  • #69
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    @Myopinion69 Yay Marx!

    "Of course, in the beginning, this cannot be effected except by means of despotic inroads on the rights of property, and on the conditions of bourgeois production; by means of measures, therefore, which appear economically insufficient and untenable, but which, in the course of the movement, outstrip themselves, necessitate further inroads upon the old social order, and are unavoidable as a means of entirely revolutionising the mode of production."
  • #91
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    @Vance1 "Voted down...Go away"
    HMMM.....is that the best you can do when YOU don't agree with someone else's views.
    You (and the religious) SCREAM loudly that there is a god. Atheist say there isn't. You have your views, we have ours. But, to not like the way a conversation goes does not give you the right to say "Voted down...Go away"
    I hate having an adult conversation with someone who screams.
  • #96
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    @stepped_in_it

    I do not have the time to argue...Nor do I choose to do so.
    If you are a non believer..Then just be a non believer...I couldn't care less.
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  • #28
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    They're losing because they don't recognize boundaries. Every church in the country can tell its adherents not to abort, that they can't marry someone of the same gender in their church, etc. The problem began when they tried to to make everyone else follow them.
  • #112
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    That's what so crazy about all this, instead of seeing infidelity and divorce among Christians as the problem... they devoted all their energy toward preventing gays from being able to marry. Instead of teaching Christians how to emulate Jesus, they devote all their energy to posting the 10 Commandments in a government courthouse. Christians in this country have opted out of doing the hard work (removing the mote from their own eye) and focused instead on the outside world.
  • #20
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    They should never of declared war to begin with but they have to have it all there way. Gays never stood in their way and only want equality. Using their religion as a bludgeon has resulted in this mess. You reap what you sow. Enjoy!
  • #9
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    Thank goodness. I honestly don't mind religion. I actually enjoy reading many religious myths. But when religious ideals take over rational though, it's a problem.
  • #15
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    But I can't help thinking that if those boys in Oklahoma had been brought up in a church, they might have turned out better.
  • #50
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    @DrMoonshine calling themselves Christians doesn't make it so. I could call myself a millionaire but I still couldn't buy a Ferrari.
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  • #92
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    Christians, or more correctly Evangelicals have a persecution complex. It validates their beliefs where their own inner faith fails. Islam provides the perfect nemesis being the polar opposite and rooted in a historical divergence.

    Not one Evangelical church has been denied a building permit. In fact it was the Evangelicals of Murfreesboro, TN who attempted to deny a permit for the construction of a mosque. Not one Evangelical church has been forced to sanctify the union of a man and a man or woman and woman. In fact it was Evangelicals who codified their scriptures in Constitutional amendments banning gay marriage.

    Evangelicals are not the persecuted, they are they persecutors.
  • #11
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    Most of the battles the Christian right is fighting today were actually lost when the Constitution was written... "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof"

    At the same time 3 out of 4 Americans self-identify as Christian, 2 out of 4 as Protestant Christian. From a cultural perspective most of the nation is Christian...

    Christians fought to preserve the institution of slavery, Christians fought to end the institution of slavery. Christians fought for women’s suffrage, Christians stood in opposition to women’s suffrage. Christians fight for equal rights for gays, Christians fight to prevent gays from being able to marry. Christians we don't believe a human being is created at the moment of conception generally fight for a woman’s right to choose an abortion, Christians who do believe that a human being is created at the moment of conception generally fight against a woman’s right to have an abortion.

    How can Christians win or lose the culture war when their constantly engaged in civil war?
  • #294
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    in the 1940s 40% of American Christians belonged to mainline protestant denominations, liberal denominations
    today 12% do
    evangelical churches have grown hundreds of times over and the catholics have unfortunately remained about steady
    the liberal churches of the past were considerably more biblical back then but are dying now
    why?
    liberal churches are a contradiction, you cant take half of God's Word to be true and deny the rest and be consistent
    so they deny the Gospel and substitute their own wisdom instead of God's perfect wisdom
    so soon enough they either become Christians or harden their hearts against God and serve the beast instead
    you cannot be moderately saved
    it is written that if God tastes a morsel and finds him to be lukewarm then he spews Him out
    the liberals can moderately believe and moderately burn in the pit forever
  • #295
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    @Ole_Okie
    It's an interesting paradox, isn't it?
    On one hand, to have a solid faith in a religion, you aren't able to deny half of your holy book, as that calls into question why you would believe in it at all.

    On the other hand, to believe the Bible is 100% true requires you to deny virtually every single field of science. Biology, Geology, Paleontology, etc.

    Even the speed of light traveling from stars refutes Young Earth Creationism (I've seen the argument that God made the light, already traveling here. That doesn't explain why we can also see supernovas.)

    At some point, whether you're moderate or fundamentalist, the only logical conclusion is that the Bible is impossible.
  • #356
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    @Saving_USA
    what're you goin on about now?
    'young earth creationism'? no man knows the age of the earth, Christians who say they do are kiddin' emselves
    neither do we know the age of the stars in the skies
    real old, billions of years, why not?
    and that is the least logical conclusion you could find bud, and a contradiction to your own self
  • #221
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    As a Christian myself, I reject the entire notion of a "culture war." Right-wing political leaders have tried to hijack American churches to advance their extremist agenda. They have tried to portray many of the most partisan issues as somehow tied up in this "religious-cultural war" for reasons of pure partisanship and lust for power. As a result, they have soiled the true meaning of the Christian faith and alienated tens of millions of non-right-wing Christians as somehow "unChristian" because we don't embrace right-wing and Republican ideology. Unfortunately, the Southern Baptist Church has been in the forefront of this hateful, bigoted, mean-spirited and un-Biblical movement that is destroying American Christianity!
  • #265
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    This is a very well-stated post. I could not agree with you more. Unfortunately, some members of my family are "right-winged religious" nuts. I am and always have been devout Christian. One of my in laws told me once that there is no way that I could be a Christian because I am a Democrat. These people think that they have the market cornered on being Christian and anybody other than them are heathens and they will burn in hell. If anything is destroying the Christian faith....it is them.
  • #349
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    @4321_Daisy

    Thanks for the nice response. As a child and a teenager in the 60's and 70's I was pretty "clueless" in a lot of ways. However, I can't recall EVER hearing this mythical link between Christianity and conservatism until seeing Pat Robertson on TV in the late 70's. Sadly, I think this whole phenomenon is driving people away from the churches by the millions!
  • #179
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    They have way to high of an opinion of themselves and their beliefs. The Southern Baptists are about the most closed minded and opinionated, unforgiving, unChristian like faction of all the holier than thou Christian groups, well, not more than the Catholics, but pretty close. When will A majority of Christians practice what they preach?
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